S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRINT

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swbluto
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S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRINT

Post by swbluto » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:55 am

Hello, I had this problem tonight as documented below.
Edit: Well, this is awfully queer. It looks like the extruder simply completely reversed the filament out of itself. That's never happened before. Is this an S3D quirk? It looks like it started going off in a random direction, laying down filament at random and crossing everything in its path. What the hell happened here? :?:

It appears that it started traveling perpendicularly to the previous line it traveled in, which could only be possible if it was traveling at a 45 degree angle and then the x and y-travel code got switched during transmission causing it to travel perpendicular to the direction it was supposed to travel. I'm willing to bet that's what it was, now why would the x and y-codes get switched? Or, why would the x and y motors switch? Or, wait, I guess all that's necessary is for the x-motor to get a negative value instead of a positive value, switching the x-motor's direction - or, maybe the x motor's direction never got reversed for some reason and it just continued on at the "turning point"? Man, this is weird.

Oh well, it reinforced the importance of wiping with a damp floursack cloth after an isopropyl alchohol wipe (Doesn't seem like acetone is necessary to promote adhesion). There were miniature streaks imprinted on the glassy bottom layer because I didn't wipe it with a damp floursack cloth afterwards.

Edit: It's doing it again. Reversed the filament and it's in zombie mode, at the exact same spot as last time. That means: There's something wrong with the G-code! Which is weird because it's not showing up in the preview window, whatever the extruder thinks it's doing now.

Hmmmm... the log window says "Firmware is unresponsive." repeatedly. That might have something to do with it. But, why's it suddenly unresponsive at the exact same spot in the print?

Okay, restarted S3D, created a new 'workspace' and put the same pieces down and closed down all other programs that might want to use the port. Also, reconnected the USB. *crosses fingers*

Okay, logs as of 1 minute into the print show no sign of firmware unresponsiveness. This is a good sign.

WTF! It reversed the filament and went into "zombie mode" at nearly the exact same spot into the print, despite starting a new file and recreating it entirely from scratch, guaranteeing a new set of G-codes. The logs also show "firmware unresponsive". WTF IS GOING ON HERE?!!! The utter repeatability of this suggests that it's S3D that's at fault but... how?? This is utterly mind blowing and f*cking ridiculous!!

Screw this, I'm running the G-codes from Cura. I'd hate to believe that the G-code is really at fault, but running from Cura will help prove that it's S3D, not the g-codes, that's at fault. Or vice versa, depending on if it does it again.

Edit: Examined the evidence more closely. Doesn't reoccur at the /exact/ same spot, just the general area. Indicates probable issue of S3D as a g-code host, not necessarily a problem of the g-codes. Executing the G-codes off of cura will prove whether it's an S3D issue - if it reoccurs, then it's possible it's a subtle hardware/software issue of some sort that I'm not likely to solve. Or, if it is a g-code issue, it doesn't seem to have exact repeatability. Anyway, I'm closely watching it now.... something's "shrilling" as the extruder goes back and forth. it's getting really close to the 'crime scene', so 'it' could happen any moment now.

Well, cura just executed the gcode perfectly indicating there's a problem with S3D as a g-code host. I'd almost suspect the developer is playing some sort of trick on me through the internet connection (The software is always connected via internet to its licensing server) given that I would doubt that S3D is really /that/ crappy as a g-code host since it's been working perfectly until /just/ now, tonight, and it's been malfunctioning almost the same, but not identically, between different g-code files. Of course, maybe there's a hacker screwing up my prints. Who knows. I guess that's a possibility since it seems my computer's become part of a botnet given how google keeps asking me for captchas, despite knowing I've never used google in a high volume way to deserve such constant captchas from google. So, I guess 'foul play' is the most probable possibility, even though I guess S3D just being 'bad G-code host software' is plausible. Still, reversing the filament and then going into 'zombie mode' seems absolutely bizarre, even for 'bad software'. That takes particular G codes that can't be 'accidentally' done by a typical software bug.

Cura doesn't have constant internet connectivity, unlike S3D, so that may be its saving grace. Okay, well, I've determined that I'm executing my gcodes from cura from now on a separate, dedicated print server. That absolutely settles that question.
Did I say something on here that offended the S3D developer? Like the fact that his forum hides posts? Or is the S3D software really just /that/ incredibly bad/awful as a G-Code host? Any ideas? The fact the software would reverse the filament out of the print head and go into 'zombie mode' multiple times into a print in /roughly/ the same area, but not the exact same spot, while cura executes the G-code perfectly is rather bizarre. Doesn't have the exact same repeatability that'd suggest a typical software problem/bug but rather 'foul play', but that seems rather unusual. I'd hate to think the developer typically gets his saturday night jollies by ruining other people's prints. That'd be rather immature, but then again, so is his forum's hiding of posts so I guess it's not beyond the realm of possibility.

Has anybody else had these problems?

If you're reading this S3D developer, just saying, I absolutely love the G code your program produces! It creates absolutely beautiful prints! Your software rocks in every possible way! Just that this 'bug' seems to be rather unbecoming of its overall excellence.

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PcS
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by PcS » Sun Jul 19, 2015 12:11 pm

I would say fix your pc first. all software is at risk if your pc is compromised. disconnect your pc from the internet and try it. print from sd card. Most developers don't appreciate aggressively negative posts. I have never once had an issue with s3d. I have used cura and it is a very capable product. S3D if faster and you simply cannot beat the support generation. Good luck :D

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Jules
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by Jules » Sun Jul 19, 2015 1:01 pm

Which version of S3D are you running? I ask because version 3.0, when I originally installed it, created some unusual slices that had to do with intersecting mesh triangles that were invisible after coming out of Rhino, until Jim ran them through another program to analyze them. The older version of S3d (version 2.2) ignored or repaired the issue before slicing. The newer version (3.0) does not. Basically, the new version seems to be much more sensitive to user error.

This might have been repaired in the last update (3.01) but I haven't had a chance to test it yet, using the file that I know has intersecting mesh.

You have a couple of choices - you can try the slice using the older version of 2.2, to see if you get a different result. If you do, it would be nice if you posted the results (with pictures and the Factory Files) over on the S3D forum in the bug report area, so that they can address the issue in the next update. (This kind of thing is extremely common with a new release - they will need a little bit of time to work the kinks out.) But they probably won't see it unless you post it over to their forum. I imagine they're pretty busy right now.

Or you can try re-installing the version 3.0 or skip to version 3.01. It's possible your install was corrupted. ;)

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ednisley
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by ednisley » Sun Jul 19, 2015 1:04 pm

swbluto wrote:Any ideas?
Yes: begin by collecting evidence and asking for advice. Don't decide what's wrong, then ignore obvious clues pointing to a different cause.

A more detailed answer at:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2526#p14371

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jimc
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by jimc » Sun Jul 19, 2015 1:59 pm

ed and pat are right. the computer running via usb can be the cause of all kinds of strange issues. with that said you need to keep in mind s3d is made to be used with just about every printer out there so the firmware settings within s3d is very important for communication. this way it knows how to talk the m2. it sounds to me at some point you didnt set it up for the m2 correctly or something got changed along the way by maybe loading someones different profile or the profile got changed. goto help/reset all settings. then goto help/configuration assistant. select the correct makergear m2 profile that applies to your machine. dont use any of those old profiles you were using before. open them up in a text editor so you can see the values then go into s3d and make new profiles and just copy all the important values for ooze control, etc. now take all those old profiles and trash them. now you will be using fresh profiles generated with 3.0.1 and set up for the m2. when you make your new profiles do not start with the one in the list labeled default. start with the one labeled as makergear m2, make the changes then click save as new. repeat until you have all your profiles remade. once you have all your profiles made, export them all and save them in a folder somewhere. on another note, s3d does not require constant internet access and there isnt any communication going on between your computer and s3d. s3d doesnt access your computer and change anything. as a printer host s3d is fantastic. i have been running it daily on a mac and a pc for 2.5 years. i almost never have communication issues and the couple i have had have been on a windows machine running beta software.

swbluto
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by swbluto » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:00 pm

Okay, so there's bugs with S3D 3.0 as it's new and that sounds like a very plausible explanation. I know that pronterface typically has USB connectivity problems for long prints (It typically just freezes mid-print, however, I see S3D tries to reconnect and keeps sending new commands.) and Cura is the only program I've used that's never, over many prints, had one problem over the USB. So, I guess it's plausible that it's a bug in S3D 3.0. Well, I'll still use S3D 3.0 as a slicer/g-code (It shines as a slicer and mainly what I bought it for; cura's slicing tends to lack polish), but I think I'll use Cura as a g-code host as that's the only program I've tried so far that's had zero issues in that role.

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Jules
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by Jules » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:41 pm

I'd try installing the 3.01 update and give it a try - they likely have it fixed by now. :D

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jimc
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by jimc » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:06 pm

There is no bug in s3d as a printer host. You are really the only person having the issue. I have not seen this pop up on their forum at all and if it was an issue people would be screaming about it. Do as i said above and you should not see a problem.

As for pronterface, there is no issue with that either. As ed said its your pc. You only have to have one background process kick in during a print and your screwed. That is why its never recommended to print with usb.

swbluto
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by swbluto » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:12 pm

Suggesting I'm the only person with the problem is absurd. This particular problem, no doubt, given how unusually specific these symptoms are, but the idea of S3D being glitchy in general as a g-code host on a windows machine, no, it's actually rather common if you look around. S3D creates great g-code, but it's not particularly robust on Windows as compared to Cura, at least as of v. 3.0.1. It's not the only program with connectivity problems on my machine - pronterface glitches as well (freezes midprint which is annoying). Cura's the only one that's been proven to be robust, likely due to its battle-hardened nature.

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jimc
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Re: S3D reverses filament, goes into ZOMBIE MODE & RUINS PRI

Post by jimc » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:15 pm

Ok well if your going to ignore everyones advise and come up with your own conclusions then why did you ask in the first place. Do whatever works for you

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